The Ellettsville, Indiana
Roll Call: Members
present were: President, Terry Baker; Vice President, Sandra
Hash; Don Calvert,
Terry Baker, Terry asked the commissioners if any of them have any
conflict of interest on any items listed on the agenda for this evenings
meeting. No conflicts of interest were
Terry Baker- Proposed changes to the Ellettsville Municipal Code- Sign Ordinances
· The term professionally made is a term that Mr. Spencer, the town's attorney, would like this removed from the proposed code changes.
· Addition- The final administration interpretation of these design standards shall be at the sole discretion of the Director of Planning Services. Regular inspections of outdoor signage will be conducted by the Planning Department failure to comply with sign regulations may result in sign permit revocation or code enforcement by the Planning Department. Since it was mentioned at the last meeting about not wanting "hand made" signs, so if the signs go through the review process and the compliance review this would help control the design of the sign from the beginning.
· Political signs to be stricken from the Ellettsville Municipal Code. The Indiana Civil Liberties Union believes current political sign codes that place time limitations on political signs is a violation of the Freedom of Speech Act.
o This code would restrict signs 10 feet from the curb line
o Keeps signs out of the highway right-of-way
o Public signs that become a public nuisance can be removed
· Ellettsville sign code- under D we state it as reduce traffic and safety hazards by prohibiting signs that are distracting to motorists and that cause unnecessary visual clutter. 152.257 (4) We allow signs to be 2 feet to the street.
Terry Baker- We need to set a distance and we need to specify that the signs can't be in the right-of-way for streets in Ellettsville.
We need to stick
with the right-of-way. It's 25 feet from
the center of the road. (But this isn't
a uniform measurement, commented
· Older subdivisions have right-of-way issues.
· We need to keep it simple.
· It sounds like we are trying to get it pretty well covered.
· At least we will be consistent in our signs.
Russ Ryle- Reeves road is a 1842 survey, two 8 foot wagon tracks, so technically if I had it two feet off the right-of-way I would be about a foot and a half into the paved area, because you have 11 and 1/2 lanes out there. You will have the same problem with the 1897 or 98 fire insurance maps. What is the right-of-way? How many of you know where the right-of-way is on your streets. The state requirements do not get into the value judgment of an inappropriate or clutter or distracting sign, they just say signs period and set the distance. The town may only want to address signs from a safety issue alone.
Given the right-of-way problems due to the development of our town over almost 200 years, would it be feasible to:
Define the limits
of putting a sign in the Town of
· You could say curb line (edge of pavement); because there are places you don't have curbs. Ten feet may be pushing it.
· Do we need greater site distances at intersections?
· What is the state limit?
What is the speed
limit in the town of
· The slower the speed they travel, the shorter the restriction on signage, what is the state limit on putting a sign near an intersection where the posted speed is 20 mph?
Terry Baker- We could go back to what the state code is and it says 10 feet from the curb line, and we could say the edge of the pavement. Proper site view is important and an issue.
Terry Baker- On
Next item: Rental Codes
· Connie thanked the Ryle's again for helping with the review of this code.
· We have a time line that we are trying to work in.
· These are original codes.
· Please read the packet and then we will address questions and concerns at each chapter.
· Addressed chapter by chapter.
· The same codes are used in the City of Bloomington, IN.
· These are tested codes and this is in our favor to move quickly.
· E-mailed the copies to you, so I've given you a printed packet.
· Mobile Homes and manufactured homes is included.
· E-mail or call in your comments on having a work session in July.
· Having a work session, busy time for families.
· Not having a work session, this is a very detailed code to rush through.
· Formal procedures for a developmental review.
Function as a
subcommittee for the
· Assist in the review of annexations and new development.
· Town code revisions and how the affect other departments.
· Provide applicants with procedures.
· Forum for sharing information.
· Membership- to have Town Engineer, and representatives from Town departments, the applicant and commission members.
· Open to Public-hearing notice posted 72 hours.
· No public comment during the meeting.
· Meet during the day.
· We could go to a set date.
· If we have more of a quorum then it is actually a meeting.
I suggest one
· We will meet as needed.
· The meetings will be held at the fire station or the library.
· Amendments will be made.
· It is interesting to see what other supervisors and departments say about the new developments, it is a good idea to be on board to the exchange of information.
· It gets everybody on the same page.
It's good to have
this before the
· This can shorten the meetings, because it's been discussed.
· We need to meet when the supervisors are working.
· Would two weeks be better?
· Since the department is so busy, two weeks would be better.
· It might be best not to have an elected official, a supervisor of the person(s) attending, or a town council member to attend. This should be spread out over several members.
· The board can choose.
· Some of us will have problems getting away during the day.
We have the
Terry Baker- Do I have a motion?
· I didn't put this in resolution form this is for operating procedures.
You have the
right to express your concerns on potential conflict of interests; this would
need to be passed on to
· You can initiate operating procedures as a commission.
· Having different engineers becomes a monetary issue.
Don Calvert-Conflict of interest with the Town Engineer and Bynum
Fanyo, although he can do that, the workshop we attended at McCormick's
recommended that anyone with a conflict leave the meeting area completely. I felt at our last meeting it didn't look
like there was a division, it was statements of support, instead of staying in
the background. I know this is legal,
we've lost members, we've had bad press and I can understand why people feel
that way. We need to stop projecting the
Sandra Hash- Discussed a neighboring community's engineer review for us when we have a conflict like this.
I think we are getting off
course. What we are looking at is what
pertains to us as an appointed members and not someone that is hired by the
town, so the engineer is out of our control and the
Terry Baker- When they see where were standing, wanting to get ethical principles here, then to me, that's a start, we've never had anything before. This is a good starting point. Let's move on.
· Will Barry Fisher be doing the work
· He will have the opportunity to make comments and suggestions and his design work will be reviewed.
· If we can get the first two phases done with the money that we have, we'll be doing very well; the B-line trail was compared.
· There are only a few residents that live adjacent to the trail area.
· What happens if the trail goes over the money that we have.
· Who is going to maintain the trail?
Our unpaid intern has started and we will be doing a number of things with her to help on the trail. I'll be on vacation next week and Connie will be in the office. I'll be back on the 15th.
Sandra Hash- The ordinance revisions went before council. They
have issues with the
Privilege of the Floor
Russ Ryle- The presented ethics and standardized rental code, could these be placed in the public library and maybe if you have two binders, one could be the last month and the next topics in the other. It would be kept on reserve. This would be a good faith effort.
Terry Baker-The Stormwater presentation by
Adjourned. Meeting time ended: Next meeting