June 8, 1998



The Ellettsville, Indiana, Town Council met in regular session at 7:30 p.m., Monday, June 8 1998.Members present were Michael Cornman, President, Geraldine McIntyre, Vice President, Donald Ashley, Gina Hawkins and Patrick Stoffers. Mr. Cornman called the meeting to order.Donald Ashley gave the prayer followed by Pledge Allegiance to the Flag.




Mike Farmer said he proposes that we accept the high bids.Mike Cornman said on the recommendation to the Utility Superintendent is there a motion to award the bids to the high bid.Donald Ashley made the motion to award the high bids for the Utility Company.Gina Hawkins seconded.Motion passed 5-0




Steve said that is where we had 2 bids that were the same.Mike Cornman said what was the suggestion for the Council?The Clerk said Mike was going to look into it.


Mike Spencer said the rule provides that you accept the high bid and he thinks you have the discretion to select either one or you could require those 2 to submit additional bids two bids that are matched and have them submit additional bids and see who breaks the tie.


Geraldine McIntyre made a motion that we have a sealed bid for the two that is tied.Donald Ashley seconded.Motion passed 5-0.


The bids will be opened at the next meeting.








Mike Cornman asked is there a motion to approve the minutes and claims?Donald Ashley so moved.Geraldine McIntyre seconded.Motion passed 5-0.






Mike Cornman said is there a lead person to maybe bring us up to date on what has happened and what is taking place.


Jacob Everage said he is the leader of the skate boarders.


Mike Cornman said a group of people came here back in the fall wasnít it.Jacob said yes.Mike Cornman said the request was for the town to have a place for the skate boarders and roller blades and bikers to have a thing.Can you tell us what has taken place and where we stand right now?


Jacob said right now we have everything except for the place.You guys talked about the liability so we got everything Jacob said right now we have everything except for the place.You guys talked about the liability so we got everything except for the place.

Mike Cornman said except for the place and liability.Does the Council members have any questions for Jake.We know people are here and we want to hear what everybody has to say and hopefully come to a conclusion on this.Now is the time to hear other people commenting on skate boarder.


Rob Hunter said he has a small business in the area ,R&D Computer Hardware Concepts, he is speaking in support of it.He has gotten involved in this recently and he will say from the human perspective that he would like to see some type of alternative sport supported in the community.He understands as a youth what it was like to be reasonably intelligent and not necessarily interested in playing baseball or basketball.From a business perspective he thinks they have done a pretty good job of making insurance and things of that nature available, the track itself.The ability to make this a mobile track.He thinks that the team that has been put together to present this could probably from a business perspective do a good job of managing this after the fact so it becomes a lucrative as well as an enjoyable adventure.He thinks it could pay for itself in short order.He also believes given the right circumstances this could be the type of sport situation where a lot of people would be pulled into it, you would have people from other areas, perhaps an entrance fee.Something where they come in and there is some type of monitoring of it.He doesnít think it would be very long at all before it paid for itself.His question is the liability, what was the Boards concern about liability?


Mike Cornman said first off it was the cost of the insurance which he is sure will be addressed here and to the liability issuers are as tall as they are wide and in all different directions.One of the jobs of the Town Council so as to prevent a liability and they are out there is really a political decision on the liability at this point is do we want to take on that liability or not.Our attorney did a massive amount or research on the liability.He has told us what is going on elsewhere in the State and even across the country of liability issues in of course skate boarding park and stuff like that.When he gave it to them it made them think a little bit more about do we want to do this or not.What the chances are who knows, this is something that has never happened before.Somebody made the comment about basketball rules, in basketball courts they have been around in this area of the country, they are more excepted.That is not their decision that is the insurance standard on liability.Anybody can sue the town for anything.What their job is to try and prevent that, so that is where they are coming from on the liability issue.We just have to make sure what is in the best interest of the town as far as trying to get sued.That is why we have insurance for but there is still things that goes above and beyond insurance that would hinder the Governmental process in our town.


Geraldine McIntyre said again we are talking about skate boarding but arenít we talking about bicycles and everything like that and you get all of this in one spot and you are going to get somebody hurt.


Rob said his understanding to this whole process is that it is skate boarding and perhaps inline skating.


Geraldine said she was under the impression that bicycles had been brought into it to.


Mike Cornman said it is all 3, and that is where we stand on that.


----------- from Bloomington and read about the article in this mornings newspaper and he want so say what he has to say about the skate park.He thinks it would be a good idea for people to just meet maybe friends and have a good time.


Shawn from Bloomington would like to see a skate park in Ellettsville because the nearest skate park from here is TA in Indianapolis and they donít allow bikers and bikes.The nearest place for bikers is Anderson.He said the one in Indianapolis you donít even have to sign anything for liability it is weird but just as long as you wear your gear, protective gear you are pretty much fine.

Mike Cornman asked him if it was supervised?


Shawn said they have video cameras on you and it is indoors.


Donald Ashley asked if he knows if it is owned by the City of Indianapolis or private.Shawn said private.


Mark Hayes said he is a member of the Freedom Riders Motor Cycle ministry.His son is involved in this and he seen the look in somebodyís face awhile ago when they talked about the inline skates and bicycles and skate boarders.This is going to be adult supervised.He will be one of the adults that would stand and watch and see that thinks went on according to the way things are supposed to be ran.There are other parents that would do that also.As far as the liability we realize there is going to be a cost to this and they have thought of fund raisers where they can get the people who actually want to get in on it and future assistance in helping.We figure this is going to have to be supervised and there is going to have to be some kind of cost also to help keep it going.


John Hayes said he is a skate boarder from Ellettsville and he pulled something off the Internet and he is going to read it.He read it to the Council and it was about skate boarders.


Debbie Hayes said we could have a fund raiser and get money together.John plays baseball and does school football and he has had torn ligaments and busted finger and all that and their insurance pays to have any repairs to his body that he needs.This is a really good group of kids and they are serious about what they are doing.

She discussed more with the Council.


Tony Stewart said he is a biker from Ellettsville and he thinks it would be good for use to get a skateboard park.He discussed more with the Council.


Doctor ----- a Bloomington resident and she is here on behalf of those groups that use the Ellettsville Community center and she teaches a fitness class there 2 nights a week.There is concern of the use of the parking lot would cause some of the programs to be effected in a negative way.The two nights that she teaches during the school year we have at least two programs at the Community Center her fitness class as well as the VFW or the brownies.Those who attend the library for meetings also use that parking lot. There have been several nights when they have had to double park because there is no space.She discussed more with the Council.


Vonda Ramsey director of the Monroe County Prevention Coalaltion for the prevention of alcohol, tabacco and drugs.She would like to commend the group of young people have advocated for actively what they are interested in.She agrees with Rob in terms of supporting the alternative sports.She discussed more with the Council.


Tony Brown is the Youth Pastor in Ellettsville. He doesnít know too much about the liability issues.He wants to approach it from another standpoint and that is that he believes that idle hands are the devils workshop.He discussed more with the Council.


Jim Fielder said he is very proud of Jake and he has watched that little guy grow up and it is nice to see him get involved is something like this, something positive.We do have an alternative sport here it is something that is not going to go away.He just today watched kids jumping off the Courthouse Square right off stepping.He recommends that they help them out anyway they can and you have some good business men back there and good business ladies that are wanting to do this and will help you out anyway they can.


Jewel said she usually works with older folks she is with Area 10 on Aging.She promised when she came to this community that she would do intergenerational things and work with the youth.She said this is one fine group of young people that you have in your community.This is the millennium generation; these are the young people that are going to lead us into the new millennium.If their last few months have showed anything it is that Ellettsville has some fine young leaders.She discussed more with the Council.


Mike Cornman wants to ask Cathy Serageste and maybe Jewel for support on this.What is the funding situation now as we stand concerns of the town were lack of money?Do one of you 2 want to give us an update on how you are going to pay for it so to speak?


Jewel said we have approximately $2,470 to contribute towards the $2,500 that is required for insurance.They also have a $300 Community Planning Grant that the young people put together.We also have Jakeís $500 Do Something Grant.Part of Jakeís $500 Do Something Grant needs to go to pay for the nitrogen they put in the torches to put the park together.One of the things she thinks Bloomington found out is you canít make a skate board park out of plywood.Before long there were ruts in it and things just went down hill.The folks here that have done the planning have planned a very nice piece of equipment that is mobile and she thinks the Do Something Grant has enough money and we have enough volunteers to put together that piece of equipment and it can be moved.

There was more discussion on this matter


Geraldine said you are talking about fundraisers and again if you are going to do that and she would really like to see this done.The kids have worked so hard on this.The town is facing a liability and we donít want to have them move from parking lot to parking lot.She really thinks they should have fundraisers and maybe get a committee together and go around and speak to some of the business people and try to put up a permanent place for these kids to be able to do this.


Jewel said I guess our issue is the interim for right now.The money that they have some of it needs to be spent or we give it back.If you have got some suggestions for the interim they would love to hear them.


Donald Ashley said he has a few questions.Do he hear someone say we would charge admission for this?Rob said yes.Don thinks that is kind of defeating what they are after but he can understand where they are coming from because you are going to have people coming from Spencer and Bloomington.The other question is they had a fellow in from Bloomington and he said they just lost all interest after a year or so.He thinks you kind of touched on that Jewel when you said the ramps got bad and some of these things they used plywood and what have you and that may explain some of that.The other thing was the supervision and he can understand the parents wanting to help supervise their children.You have got to remember it is just not your children that you are supervising.You maybe supervising quite a number of children at one time down there.You are talking about something that is going to be very time consuming for parents and he is sure you all work.He can see where that could soon run in to a problem as far as scheduling and trying to watch that.That concerns him.The other thing is they have a conflict of locations with time and he didnít hear anybody say how long you are going to allow this skating to go.8 hours a day or twice a week or what ever.He can see a conflict with that parking lot.


Jewel said she could be wrong but she was given the understand that the Parks and Rec. had said that they for the summer they were going to be focusing on other areas as far as Monroe County.


A lady said the Community Center there is ----- program.The program is not available though the summer and she doesnít know what they are planning for fall.The Community Center is still open for people who wish to use the space the martial arts classes are there that run from she believe 5 or 5:30 until 6 or so.The VFW and sometimes the Brownies will meet there after 6.Once fall comes there will be a lot more activities going on at the Center.

Don said the 2 things that really concern him about this whole thing is apparently the liability premium and you have that pretty well figured out for this year.What really concerns him is the location and conflict of time and the parents.He thinks the parents are more than willing to help, that is not what he is saying he is saying you are going to have the same problem we have got with the location you are going to have conflict of time and that can create a problem.

There was a lot more discussion on this matter.


Mike Cornman said obviously there is concern and he is not for having this in a parking lot, he doesnít think it is a good idea what so ever.To say we need to give site permission somewhere right now unless we use one of the town owned lands.He thinks general fund owns a couple spots and their parking lots.Really the proper people to go to is the Ellettsville Park and Recreation Commission.He is for this especially on a one-year program to see how it works for awhile and see if the support is there.

Mike talked more on this matter and he supports this and especially if it is not going to cost the town any money.


Gina said she agrees a 100% with everything that you have said, those same thoughts came to her mind was the youth sports league had to start the same way and this is an alternative sport that has got to start somewhere.The baseball league was an alternative sport as some point back through the years.Jake and the kids have done a lot of work.We have got some great parents it looks like for some supervision.She thinks we have tried to cover the liability issue as well as we can there always is going to be liability.She is in full support of the program.


Don said these kids did a fine job of putting this together.They have brought it before us and they have served the purpose and did a nice job with it.He is glad they have the support that they have got.Most of his questions have been answered.He doesnít see why they could try a one-year program on this.


Gina said the other thing she just wanted to add she thinks what he said about starting an organization that is one of the concerns that we have is that there is definite structure to the program.That there is definitely a scheduling thing, there is definitely going to be supervision and that type of thing.A definite structured committee or something that is going to bring to us somebody that is definitely in charge.


Patrick Stoffers said he is satisfied that we should do this.


There was more discussion on this matter.


Mike Cornman said for the request that is here he wants to suggest that we deny the request for the parking lot but yet give full support for establishing an organization and assisting in any way possible within our limits to do so.When we say we are going to deny that is the parking lot not deny what you want to do with the program.That is what his suggestion would be.


There was another discussion about the parking lot and this matter.


Mike Farmer said why donít you give you blessing to this and let the site be worked out and let the association be put together and they you can negotiate that.


Mike Cornman said the motion would be to support the skateboarding project.Geraldine McIntyre made a motion to approve the skate boarding but deny on the town parking lot, give it to Area 10 and its agents for a one year period to work out with parks and rec.ís a location and form a committee to continue working for a permanent place.

Pat said there is two motions there.Mike Cornman asked Mike Spencer if he could suggest a motion.


There was more discussion on the motion between the Council and the Attorney.


Mike Cornman suggest a motion that we approve the skate boarding project and the use of the town parking lot-Mike Spencer said permit Area 10 on the Aging to use the parking lot for the purpose of skate boarding, inline roller bladeing, and free style biking.Mike Cornman so moved.Gina Hawkins seconded.Motion passed 5-0.




Pat Stoffers said he had a meeting with Julianne of Virtual Design last Thursday and she is preparing a proposal for the web site and she will be ready for presentation to the Council at the next meeting.He recommends that if any Department heads or Council members have any content suggestions for that site be sure and get them to him as soon as possible so he can forward them to Virtual Design.


Mike Cornman said that would determine the cost.

There was more discussion on this.






Renee Norris and she is representing Cherry Hill at 417 East 16th Street in Bloomington.They are requesting road blocking for the benefit of 13 young people going to Jamaica on a mission trip this summer, July 18th through 25th.They are going to be ministering in hospitals and nursing homes and they will be sharing with people who are on the streets.At night they are going to be ministering in different churches.They will only have one day at the beach and they are all disappointed.It is a $1,000 a person and they have been working on raising funds since March.


Mike Cornman said in the past what other organizations have done has asked permission to they call it road block but it is not really a roadblock to ask for donations at the stop light only on Sales Street.They can not give permission for the highway itself.


Mike Cornman recommended a motion that they allow the Cherry Hill Christian Center request for roadblocks not to exceed 3 days in the month of June.Renee said so we will just do it the next 3 Saturdays in the month of June.Patrick Stoffers so moved.Donald Ashley seconded.Motion passed 5-0.




Geraldine McIntyre said he came before the Planning Commission last month.What he really wants to do is have that alley vacated and he is planning on building a two-story house, if he can get the alley vacated.That would give him more room between the house he plans to build and the house that Mike Cornman once lived in.It would make everything along there look better.There is no where you can go in that alley unless you drive into the school because the school backs up to the lot that he is purposing to build a house on.He first wanted a Variance and we told him it was better to come before the Town Council and vacate the alley.


Mike Cornman read Ordinance 98-17.Mike Cornman asked is there a motion for submission of Ordinance 98-17 first reading.Geraldine McIntyre so moved.Donald Ashley seconded.Motion passed 5-0.


Gina Hawkins said I move the Ordinance 98-17 be adopted on the same day at which it is introduced.Donald Ashley seconded.Motion passed 5-0.


Gina Hawkins moved that Ordinance 98-17 be adopted.Donald Ashley seconded.Motion passed 5-0.




Rick Coppock said we have been investigating different types of software to upgrade the townís accounting and billing system.After looking at 6 or 7 different types and different suppliers, software vendors and checking out those references.The company, the choice of all involved, Diana, Sandy, Kay Jeff, Mike and himself, the company that we like the best is called Komputrol they are owned by AE Boyce they make most of the governmental forms.We need to get firm prices and go with Komputrol as the supplier of the software.We will be coming back and we are going to put together a bid package for the hardware, which also needs to be upgraded.We have had a variety of proposal and quotes from different people of different types.We looked at PC base software and based upon our recommendation we are going with Komputrol a some what upgraded version of what we have now and submit for quotes a AS400 system and will probably want to have a 5 year lease purchase.Based on what it is going to cost it is probably somewhere between 15 to 20 thousand dollars.

Rick said we want to get the Boards approval to start the process with Komputrol.Diana and Sandy have been wanting to go with Komputrol for awhile but we were still looking a PC based software and none those types fit the needs and they were pretty much new to the governmental type business and so we went with something a little more reliable.


Mike Cornman said this is a new AS400 right?Rick said yes a new system and we will probably get 2 or 3 PCís for this office down here and connect it to upstairs.

The estimated software cost is around $14,000

Mike Cornman said on the recommendation of Rick Coppock suggest to the Council that we approve Komputrol as our computer vendor.Rick said based on that recommendation we will get a firm budget price proposal, he wanted to make you aware that is where we are going and this is the direction we are going.Rick said we were talking PC based software but it didnít seem to have that good of reference to switch a whole town to PC based.We will bring back the prices on the software and hardware.Maybe the 2nd meeting in July we should have firm prices on hardware.


Gina Hawkins made a motion we accept Komputrol as our software vendor.Geraldine McIntyre seconded.Motion passed 4-1, Pat voted nay.




Rick Coppock said in talking with Mike about the properties and getting rid of these properties the difference between if the town owns it or the Utilities Department owns it.They are researching who owns.He called Fred Ponton today and told him that is where we are at because he made the original request.

Mike Cornman said you need to notify Bob Mundy.Rick will.







†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† CONCERNING RATES FOR SLUDGE DISPOSAL:


Gina Hawkins read Ordinance 98-16.This is a first reading.Mike Cornman said is there a motion to submit Ordinance 98-16 first reading.Donald Ashley so moved.Gina Hawkins seconded.Motion passed 4-1, Geraldine McIntyre voted nay.




Mike Farmer said we just need to approve purchase of easement to put a water main and make final connection on the new Chester Drive water main.It is a standard 15-foot easement it is on their property line and it doesnít inhibit their use of their land and it just allows us to have permanent access with the water main.It is a standard easement.The purchase price is $300.


Mike Cornman said is there a motion to approve the water line easement agreement with Turtle Back Swim Club.Gina Hawkins so moved.Patrick Stoffers seconded.Motion passed 5-0.




Mike Farmer said he just needs your approval to start the acquisition process of easement on Reeves Road for a new water main.It will go from Louden Road to Starnes Road.He just needs your approval to start the easement acquisitions.The acquisitions hopefully will come at no cost to the Utilities.


Mike Cornman said is there a motion for the utilities to approval of acquisitions of easements on Reeves Road.Donald Ashley so moved.Gina Hawkins seconded.Motion passed 5-0.






Steve informed the Council that Ronnie is back and is feeling good.




Rick said he had a call from Ted Ferguson concerning Northern Sewer Corporation and they would like to discuss the town taking over the Northern Sewer Corporation.When you get a meeting together with Larry Dunbar and Ted Ferguson.


Mike Cornman will call Larry Dunbar.




Diana informed the Council that she will be attending State Board of Account school this week.Mike Cornman said okay.




Gina Hawkins made the motion to adjourn.Geraldine McIntyre seconded.Motion passed 5-0.